[scribus] Windows can't crash - very strange comment

Jeffrey Silverman jeffrey.d.silverman at gmail.com
Tue Mar 24 15:45:04 CET 2009

Once again, we've diverted off-topic. But I think that's fine, I mean,
I'm certainly not one to talk.

Anyway, I thought I'd chime in. Me: I am a big Linux and f/oss
advocate. I don't use Windows (or Mac OS, ftm) if I can help it. And
mostly, I can help it. I work for a company that hosts and supports a
major OSS product for the education market. I've put "environment must
be amenable to use of open source software" on my resume. I won't even
apply for jobs that will force me to use a Windows desktop (and
luckily I have been able to do this successfully)

However, and I know these comments have mostly been tongue-in-cheek[1]
but I am not an advocate of OS bashing, even if it is for sound
reasons. I have been using Linux for more than 10 years, and
exclusively[2], at home *and* at work, for at least 7 years, as both a
desktop OS and a server OS. In that time, I have experienced many
problems, including crashes and instability. OTOH, Windows 2000,
Windows XP (all patched and updated) hardly ever crashes. So, some
points to bring thsi discussion closer to reality:

 - Linux is not the OS, it is the kernel. The OS includes all that
other stuff, too, so you can actually use it. I've seen comments
pretty close to "Linux OS never crashes" and that is patently false.
If X crashes (and it certainly does), does that mean that your OS has
not crashed? It is splitting hairs, but from the POV of the desktop
user, if X has crashed, the OS has crashed.

 - Windows 2000 and XP are actually *extremely* stable OSes. I can't
vouch for Vista. The days of BSODs and other lockups and crashes
ended, mostly, with the EOL of Win 98.

 - Windows crashes and Linux crashes usually amount to the same thing:
a driver issue. Most frequently video drivers. Given sample
installations of Windows XP with MS-blessed drivers and a Linux
installation with the most stable possible driver versions (not sure
about blessings), neither OS will crash, pretty much.

 - Most comparisons of Windows vs Linux are so apples vs oranges as to
be very unrealistic. This goes for comparisons made by both the
Windows-promoting MS monoculture and the Linux-promoting F/OSS
culture. I have seen very few, if any, good comparisons made with very
similar starting points. Similar machines, similar software installed,
similar driver stability, etc. Most comparisons can be thrown right
out the window (no pun intended)

 - Many F/OSS products, while great, are still also very unstable or
buggy. Biggest case in point is Firefox. Firefox (or "The Web
Browser") is probably the single most used app on today's desktop.
However, and this goes for my Windows using coworkers, FF is unstable
as hell. It crashes at least daily. Internet Explorer, while sucky for
web developers, sucky for maintaining desktop security, and sucky for
a number of other reasons, at least doesn't crash. I'm talking IE6.
Dunno about stability of IE7, but I'm guessing its comparable.

YIKES! I cannot believe I am defending Microsoft, but there it is. I
know the community here tends to be anti-microsoft, as many F/OSS
communities are, but really I prefer to see balanced arguments and not
just plain ol' bashing.

Thanks! Seeya! Later!

[1] Whatever that means. I've never really got that expression.
[2] With some minor exceptions that couldn't be helped

On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 7:10 AM, Fritz Eichelhardt <f.eichelhardt at web.de> wrote:
> hi all,
>> From: Roger <hovergo at net-tech.com.au>
>> Subject: [scribus] Windows can't crash - very strange comment
>> > > >> I have never heard of anything else crashing on a
>> > > >> Windows platform.
>> > >
>> > > as far as i know, windows can't even crash, unless you
>> > > use very unreliable
>> > > software like scribus.
>> Either that is the most unfair comment I have heard or it is a piece of
>> humour, can't decide..
> at first, let me complete the citation:
>> > it's a pity, but i can't afford this lovely peace of
>> > software and have to use
>> > linux instead.
>> >
>> > by pure luck, scribus/linux never crashes here.
>> >
> if that was meant as a (unfair) comment, it would be very stupid as well.
> an os that can be crashed by a software, is crap, not an os.
> i have to admit: even my few remained friends find my humour sometimes
> somewhat strange, but they got used to it.
> btw: i write almost everthing, even my (business-)letters, in scribus.
> On Saturday 21 March 2009 04:18:01 am Phil Ward wrote:
>> helloooooo
>> can i come and live in your world? where windows never
>> crashes?
> shure - always welcome.
> the name of that world is linux.


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